Curse

Phoenix Arrows · Jul 24, 2006, 09:28 PM // 21:28

/signed

Doing all the missions is a pain sometimes, especially when you're short on time. I am pondering whether to remake my Ranger, but the reason it's still here is that I don't have time for the missions.

pork soldier · Jul 24, 2006, 09:48 PM // 21:48

I like the locked gates, the way I see it there are two options to stop runners - 1: locked gates, 2: make the areas so RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing annoying that no one can run them (then we get to suffer through them when we *do* pve).

I heavily prefer locked gates over the perma ice-snared state I find myself in during the southern shiverpeaks or the OMFG RUN FROM TEH SCARABS crap in the desert.

DFrost · Jul 24, 2006, 11:02 PM // 23:02

I agree, the locked gates should go. Seeing lvl3 players in Droknar's annoyed me a lot less (= not at all) than having to play all the missions over and over again in Cantha, in the same order too. Actually I've taken only one of my Tyrian characters through GW:F, the rest are still at Nahpui/Tahnnakai. Same goes for the one Canthan character I made.

So where are all of the characters nowadays? In Tyria exploring, doing quests and missions in whatever order they want, skipping the things they don't feel like doing at the moment.

Sir Mad · Jul 25, 2006, 01:52 AM // 01:52

Quote:

My playstyle affects nobody else, and I don't see why I should be limited because someone else says so, rather than valid concerns from the game design end.
If human players bother you, sorry, but there's no quality control in the game. Even people that play through the game entirely can not understand a thing about it. Especially to the end of PvP. However, I don't think I've ever seen a PvP'er arguing for the removal of PvE because of W/Mo's that come into the arenas with Mending and Healing Hands, wearing armor and weapons that distinguish them as PvE players.
There are always hench, and trying failed missions again, weaning out the poorer players.

You know this comparison is ridiculous - sorry if my post gets included in the +20% chance to delete now.

I think we'll have advanced when most of the players will have understood you do not have to beat all the campaigns, with all your toons, and that it won't even penalize your chars (as you can unlock skills and buy them anywhere - etc...).

Alright, so here basically, we have 2 sides, unable to talk to each other: the pros (including me) who cannot find any reason to let players skip a part of the game, and the cons who cannot find any reason to have to play the whole game.

If you want this thread to become constructive, maybe it's time to propose new stuff, to try to make everybody at least partially happy.

Let's take Tyria as an example (note: I'm not suggesting ANET to change Tyria: I'm just using this example to have places and missions well-known to illustrate this idea). Would it be that unfair if it was locked by "region", ie: you can wander arounf Ascalon, or Kryta, or the jungle, etc, but you gotta complete a few missions/quests to reach the next region. Using such a model for the next campaigns would let players explore many maps without having to beat a mission every map or so, would let them skip some quests if they want to, but at the same time would prevent people from running the whole game.

That's the fairest for everybody I can imagine.

Now, if you wanna keep flamming each other, go on.

WasAGuest · Jul 25, 2006, 02:55 AM // 02:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir Mad

Let's take Tyria as an example (note: I'm not suggesting ANET to change Tyria: I'm just using this example to have places and missions well-known to illustrate this idea). Would it be that unfair if it was locked by "region", ie: you can wander arounf Ascalon, or Kryta, or the jungle, etc, but you gotta complete a few missions/quests to reach the next region. Using such a model for the next campaigns would let players explore many maps without having to beat a mission every map or so, would let them skip some quests if they want to, but at the same time would prevent people from running the whole game.

That destroys the illusion of a world though. I don't care much for runners to be honest, I think it's silly, but I also think that's the players business and not mine.
I don't like the locked gates because there are times I can't find a group of friends online to group with and henchies don't always cut it. So I pick up and explore the land. I find this a great deal of fun and entertaining. In Factions, I could not do this and it completely ruined a HUGE amount of fun for me.
In the idea of thinking constructively, I'll add again the idea I posted before:

Make the merchants refuse to sell you armor or skills further through the story untill you have completed certain quests and missions. There would be no reason to be run then other than just to explore and play the game.
Tyria as example again: Droks merchats will ignore you untill you have completed ascention and gone through Dragon's Lair.

Kijik Oni Hanryuu · Jul 25, 2006, 03:52 AM // 03:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sai of Winterland

Please, stop with the comments about "whiners." Seriously. Some of the people here have very strong opinions or legitimate complaints and are not whining as you see it. Sure there are some complaints with people who whine, but there are a majority that are solid complaints. If you been here long enough, this place is populated with hardcore players who have the spine to tell what is wrong or right about the game. It has always been that way and they were never afraid to express it. They never whine like babies. Most of the changes in the game were caused by the people in this forum because they weren't scared to give the hard-hitting answers. Some good, some bad, depending on the person. If you can't take the strong opinions of some players, maybe this is not the place for you.

I am not saying that all people who have a complaint are whiners, I undertsand that there arevery valid complaints with good backing that are very constructive and do include ways to fix the problem. I am trying to rid these boards of the useless whiners, who constantl fill the board with useless statements and complaints about thing that should not be changed due to the fact that it would do more hurt than help, and also come in with out validating their complaint or giving reasons to fix the problem, I want these whiners to leave so that we can answer the truly valid complaints, I am doing this due to being tired of having to fish through various threads to find the one credible post.

Edit: And uh Wasaguest, this came to my mind when thinking of tyria, the reason that the missions have to be done also, is for the sake of a timeline, now think of it, suddenly you come out of presearing and you play through the missions up to the shiverpeaks, now some time MUST have passed during that time, so it wouldn't really make sense if someone can suddenly pass a "year" of the game by getting run through it now would it? A good RPG must have a storyline and a timeline of some sort..

Sinborn · Jul 25, 2006, 04:11 AM // 04:11

Consider the amulet-reward at the end of the game.

It wouldn't be worth much if you could just speed your way to the end. Granted, there are some problems with the door system, especially concerning buddies, but it worked well in making Factions a challenge. The world is supposed to inconvenience you!

/N-S'd, make the next chapter even more brutal and hair-tearing!

jackie · Jul 25, 2006, 05:05 AM // 05:05

/signed

I loved the sense of freedom when I first time stumbled to Lion's Arch.

WasAGuest · Jul 25, 2006, 12:35 PM // 12:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kijik Oni Hanryuu

Edit: And uh Wasaguest, this came to my mind when thinking of tyria, the reason that the missions have to be done also, is for the sake of a timeline, now think of it, suddenly you come out of presearing and you play through the missions up to the shiverpeaks, now some time MUST have passed during that time, so it wouldn't really make sense if someone can suddenly pass a "year" of the game by getting run through it now would it? A good RPG must have a storyline and a timeline of some sort..

I don't disagree at all with the timeline point. In fact I support it via differnt methods. If merchants didn't sell to you, or you couldn't enter "future" missions without finishing the ones previously the reason to skip areas would be only to explore. I do not support a closed world that destroys the game world though, and that's what the locked gates do.
Imagine this:
I'm exploring through cantha and come to a broken bridge being repaired by NPCs. They tell me the repairs will be done shortly so I have to turn back. Ok, I can't go that way as the "story" hasn't been completed there yet. I finish a mission and now the bridge is completed and I can pass. Story line moved and there was a reason the pass was out.
As it is now, I can wander around and for no reason at all, there's a gate that's locked. Why? No reason a gate would be there in the middle of a city. How do merchants and tradesmen within the city import and export their goods? How does the city transport food into and out of the city?
The entire illusion of a real city is shattered with lock gates and no explanation behind them as to the story of why.
I have yet to see a valid reason to keep the locked gates however other than it annoys people that others chose not to play through the game. That's not a valid reason, that's why I don't like it, but that's a personal option and opinion and my opinion shouldn't be forced on others. It doesn't weed out anyone, it doesn't filter better and worse players so grasping at possible reasons seems silly.
The only reason that makes even a slight amount of since is that Factions is too short and the gates were added to make it seem longer; that's a design flaw and hopefully will be addressed in Nightfall.

Draxx · Jul 25, 2006, 12:39 PM // 12:39

If you Dont like runners dont use them,

I Dont Get the Kill all the Runner attitude, infact i despise it.

In a MMO there should eb a option to do what the hell you want for the MOST PART not the whole game.

and you can mooooooan and hate runners all you want, but why do you really CARE... remove the locked gate because the idea of a partly linear MMO is not apealing to most Gamers.

and i hav no idea why people would VOTE to keep something that will NOT make a differance to them anyway.

They shall be named... The Running Nazi's

/Signed

Slainster · Jul 25, 2006, 12:43 PM // 12:43

/signed . .. i like the freedom to choose how I play

Xenrath · Jul 25, 2006, 12:47 PM // 12:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Praetor

/Notsigned
To some degree, getting runs is cheating. Not a serious form of cheating, but still subverting the normal progress.

No it isn't. There was some magazine article or other (or maybe it was a web interview I forget exactly) where Anet employees acknowledged running exists and said it was part of the game.

That kind of kills the "it's to stop running" argument, unless Anet have changed their minds again, in which case nobody knows because there's been no official word about it.

Tyria: freedom to do what you want and go where you want, except some key areas. Free to skip the eye wateringly boring parts to find the places you do like being.

Cantha: well, not really.

Xenrath · Jul 25, 2006, 12:54 PM // 12:54

Here we go I found it:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guild Wars

Wanna know a secret? We put in the ability to make such runs as an intended design element. Sure we could prevent it, but it's not our objective to do so. If people want to power-level a friend, or even turn offering a running service into a cash-raising profession, it's really ok with us.

http://guildwars.gameamp.com/guildwars/gwInterview

So there you have it. I'm convinced more now than ever the gates are there to prop up a short and poor PvE campaign.

Evilsod · Jul 25, 2006, 01:24 PM // 13:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sinborn

Consider the amulet-reward at the end of the game.

It wouldn't be worth much if you could just speed your way to the end. Granted, there are some problems with the door system, especially concerning buddies, but it worked well in making Factions a challenge. The world is supposed to inconvenience you!

/N-S'd, make the next chapter even more brutal and hair-tearing!

So make the amulet available to people who only complete all missions. Its not hard you know.

Myself, i loved going through all the missions and primary quests over and over and over, 5 down. 3 more chars to go. Fun isn't it? /bullshit.

Infact i love them that much i just run the ones i can. Things like Stolen Eggs, and practically anything that doesn't need me to escort/kill people.

Draxx · Jul 25, 2006, 02:49 PM // 14:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenrath

Here we go I found it:

http://guildwars.gameamp.com/guildwars/gwInterview

So there you have it. I'm convinced more now than ever the gates are there to prop up a short and poor PvE campaign.

You Should Get some kind of Award for that Post. Lol!

Blackhawk · Jul 25, 2006, 03:05 PM // 15:05

/signed

One thing I hate about Factions compared to Prophecies is the inability to explore and play the game how I want to, (might explain why all my Factions toons are in Tyria)

viper008 · Jul 25, 2006, 03:10 PM // 15:10

Not singed and no need to speculate what they are going to do since it’s just a waste of time and energy. At the end of the day Anet is going do what they want anyway.

wilq · Jul 25, 2006, 05:14 PM // 17:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by viper008

Not singed and no need to speculate what they are going to do since it’s just a waste of time and energy. At the end of the day Anet is going do what they want anyway.

in the same way it's a waste of energy and time to live since we're going to die anyway

viper008 · Jul 25, 2006, 05:17 PM // 17:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by wilq

in the same way it's a waste of energy and time to live since we're going to die anyway

Yes but at least we have the choice how live our lives where in case of Anet we don't at the end of the day.

viper008 · Jul 25, 2006, 05:18 PM // 17:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by wilq

in the same way it's a waste of energy and time to live since we're going to die anyway

Yes but at least we have the choice how we live our lives where in case of Anet we don't at the end of the day.